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View Full Version : OCG Banned and Restriction List Update



Harsickle
15th September 2015, 06:47 AM
Only new additions are written

Banned:

Elder God Noden
Tellarknight Ptolmaeus

Restricted:

Elemental Hero Shadow Mist
Glow-Up Bulb
Insight Magician
Deep Sea Diva
Shrit, Strategist of the Nekroz

Semi-Restricted:

Kuribandit
Mermail Abyssteus
Evigishki Gustkraken
Mind Control
Book of Moon
Charge of the Light Brigade
Gold Sacrophagus
Allure of Darkness
Dragon Shrine
Gateway of the Six
Sinister Shadow Games
Crush Card Virus

Back to 3

Elemental Hero Bubbleman
Honest
Chaos Emperor Dragon - Envoy of the End
Dark Magician of Chaos
Blackwing - Gale the Hurricane
Manju of the Ten Thousand Hands
Formula Synchron
Wind-Up Zenmaity
Instant Fusion
Magical Stones Excavation
Transmigration Prophecy
Bottomless Trap Hole

Hope in the Interstice
15th September 2015, 06:52 AM
What is this "Search Results"?

Harsickle
15th September 2015, 07:15 AM
Sorry for the weird list earlier on.

This is verified on japan Maxut blog

TheRamenNoodle
15th September 2015, 07:33 AM
I sorta like this list, but I wish Mist wasn't limited, and that Emem got way more hits. At least the OCG now has 3 bottomless, not that it matters if the pendulums go first...

Whatever. I don't play the OCG anyway.

Harsickle
15th September 2015, 07:39 AM
Entermate Entermage still draws breath

Woe to me

Serenity
15th September 2015, 07:41 AM
Can we take the "newly forbidden" cards and add them to the TCG banlist? ;)
Oh and unless I'm missing something,like Shi-En is banned there, Gateway to 2 is stupid,I get that they have so much backrow that even managing to summon one monster should be considered a victory but op card is op anyway....

TenseiPatu
15th September 2015, 07:54 AM
Semi-limited list sounds really interesting. Also, that unlimited Honest

kc_alex2
15th September 2015, 07:54 AM
Well, I think Konami OCG couldn't easily cut down EMEm at first, due to Anime-Reasons. At least Ptolemaeus is dead and Bottomless at 3 is also something neat, if you start against EMEm.
Maybe, I should try Old School Light Beat with 3x Rai-Oh, 3x Honest, 3x Bottomless and stuff.

Hope in the Interstice
15th September 2015, 08:00 AM
Well, I think Konami OCG couldn't easily cut down EMEm at first, due to Anime-Reasons. At least Ptolemaeus is dead and Bottomless at 3 is also something neat, if you start against EMEm.
Maybe, I should try Old School Light Beat with 3x Rai-Oh, 3x Honest, 3x Bottomless and stuff.
I hardly find that substantial reason to not at least put one or two cards on the Limited list. And Shock Master still has no excuse.

kc_alex2
15th September 2015, 08:13 AM
I hardly find that substantial reason to not at least put one or two cards on the Limited list. And Shock Master still has no excuse.
Actually, it's one of the only reasons that makes sense. Back in November 2014, Nekroz (with zero relevance in the anime) invaded the metagame with Manju, Senju, Preperation and Unicore all being limited in January 2015 as result. Konami OCG can, if they really want.

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 09:18 AM
I'm finding the Honest unlimiting making sense, especially when there are quite a few cards that can have the Armades effect (aka opponent unable to activate cards if this monster attacks), like Frightfur Sheep, and S39 Utopia Lightning. The latter is especially threatening.

Konami did good with the Ptoly and Noden ban. pls bring to TCG

Roxzen
15th September 2015, 09:52 AM
FFF Ptolemaeus ban. How am I supposed to make Leo Arms now, run Level 5s again? gdi
lol at CED @3. Make sense considering that they "errata"'d it, but never thought it would actually go straight to 3.

GodYuya
15th September 2015, 10:21 AM
Time for change!
Let's have a burial for all metas incl. tellarknight, Nekroz, Magician, Atlantean... except EmEM AND THE BROKEN CyberDragonINFINITY
ITS TIME FOR ABYSS - BURNING ABYSS

hardedge
15th September 2015, 10:37 AM
Time for change!
Let's have a burial for all metas incl. tellarknight, Nekroz, Magician, Atlantean... except EmEM AND THE BROKEN CyberDragonINFINITY


Infinity was NEVER broken, Ptolemaios was. It gave R4NK access to Infinity which was already neutered to: Rank 5 (not an easy engine) AND Machines (more restriction).

Tellarknight's engine has not received a hit this list aside from the Noden and the Ptolemaios, instead it got a 3rd Honest. Constellar Dia being more difficult to pull off hurt them a bit though.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 11:33 AM
Maybe the incessant Rank 4 bitching will lessen a little now.

Hope in the Interstice
15th September 2015, 11:38 AM
Maybe the incessant Rank 4 bitching will lessen a little now.
Nnnnnnnope. All Rank 4 lost were Ptolemaeus and Norden. Little dents in the overall machine.

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 11:41 AM
Nnnnnnnope. All Rank 4 lost were Ptolemaeus and Norden. Little dents in the overall machine.

then again, iirc OCG has Shock Master among its ranks, so the loss of Ptoly isn't much for them.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 11:42 AM
Nnnnnnnope. All Rank 4 lost were Ptolemaeus and Norden. Little dents in the overall machine.

No Ptolemaeus = no Infinity, though.

I'm sure a lot of the bitching revolved around Infinity.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 11:42 AM
I can't help but find the clamoring for the ban of Shock Master hilarious. I love the list. Konami always letting us play the game in fun and different ways. Norden being banned is laughable at best, but it does save my Instant Fusion, I suppose. Poor god ate too much ramen. Banned Ptolemaios is pretty much the one thing I wanted to have. I know people think the obvious deck was neglected, but that's not how you should look at it. With Ptolemaios banned, we have a little less problems. TCG should follow suit, Rank 4 shouldn't be able to casually jump into 5, 6, or even 7.

Man, life is okay sometimes. The game won't stop clowning around for now, but that will just as well change next time. And with some new, surprisingly fun toys to play around with, I can actually play against the clowns.

kahunyu
15th September 2015, 12:50 PM
Shock's a bigger problem now because M&m can still go into it faster than any other deck out there, and it basically auto-wins the mirror alongside 90% of games when paired with Rafflesia.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 12:59 PM
Shock Master is actually one of the worst options for the deck to go into, considering that the deck prefers to OTK. It's a 1-of in every deck for good reason, putting in most of its work in the mirror match. Just because a deck can make a card, doesn't mean that it is a go-to or that it is always a smart way to play. Do remember that this deck prefers its offensive plays, and you must be doing something very right for them to choose to make Shock Master at all.

The deck is a problem, but the last thing to hit is Shock Master. Flame Mascot is a problem, it needs to go to 1. Trick Clown is a problem, it needs to go to 0. It would be foolish to expect that this format, but it will happen down the line.

Mystic TimeKeeper
15th September 2015, 01:03 PM
As far as I know they go to Shockmaster if they start, so roughly 50% of the time I guess, you don't need more than 1 to lock down people these days. The clowns need to burn in hell but Shockmaster is still a problem that needs to be addressed.

Hope in the Interstice
15th September 2015, 01:08 PM
Shock Master is actually one of the worst options for the deck to go into, considering that the deck prefers to OTK. It's a 1-of in every deck for good reason, putting in most of its work in the mirror match. Just because a deck can make a card, doesn't mean that it is a go-to or that it is always a smart way to play. Do remember that this deck prefers its offensive plays, and you must be doing something very right for them to choose to make Shock Master at all.

The deck is a problem, but the last thing to hit is Shock Master. Flame Mascot is a problem, it needs to go to 1. Trick Clown is a problem, it needs to go to 0. It would be foolish to expect that this format, but it will happen down the line.
I'm no OCG player, believe you me, but I think there's a problem with your reasoning. It's not flawed but I believe the perspective needs flipping.

Shock Master isn't something you'd go into if you're going second. However, if you're going first, you go into this bastard as hard and fast as you can. From there, you call the card type that will stop your opponent from making any traction. If your opponent goes first, they can use whatever they want to set up. However, if you manage to call Spells or Monsters, that nips a ridiculous amount of decks in the bud and stop them from setting up entirely. They need traps or reactive monster effects to stop you from steamrolling them, which you can nullify with Shock Master again. Like if you were going second, you now have the opportunity to kick their rear only they're denied the set up that could've saved them from this.

It's at 1 in every deck but you really don't need more than one.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 01:35 PM
I'm no OCG player, believe you me, but I think there's a problem with your reasoning. It's not flawed but I believe the perspective needs flipping.

Shock Master isn't something you'd go into if you're going second. However, if you're going first, you go into this bastard as hard and fast as you can. From there, you call the card type that will stop your opponent from making any traction. If your opponent goes first, they can use whatever they want to set up. However, if you manage to call Spells or Monsters, that nips a ridiculous amount of decks in the bud and stop them from setting up entirely. They need traps or reactive monster effects to stop you from steamrolling them, which you can nullify with Shock Master again. Like if you were going second, you now have the opportunity to kick their rear only they're denied the set up that could've saved them from this.

It's at 1 in every deck but you really don't need more than one.

This isn't the first time someone wanted Shock Master banned, though. Yosenju, Thunder Family, even the Utopia spam decks had people wanting the card gone. Now, I seem to have explained this poorly, and I apologize. People are always wanting Shock Master banned in the OCG just because it is banned in the TCG. The card itself has many adherent flaws and faults to it that I don't see a problem with. The problem is that a deck can make it as well as many other Xyz play in the same turn. Let me put it this way: before the clown deck, to invest in Shock Master would more than likely be your entire turn's efforts. And to put all of your eggs into one basket is a risk versus reward scenario. There are plenty of outs to it, but more than likely you will get even a little pay-off for your efforts.

As an OCG and TCG player, I suppose I can take for granted what others experience with the card from the TCG side. It's been banned for ages and people remember some shenanigans from the old days. I know that it is bad design to have a card that doesn't let the opponent play the game, but a lot of Side Deck cards do just that, as well. If the clown deck is rightfully stunted, the problems with Shock Master go away. Maybe the argument is that as long as level 4 persists, Shock Master will always loom on the horizon as a sort of boogeyman, but I really don't see it that way. It is designed to be a high-investment gamble.

Just as Norden was banned to save Instant Fusion, the clowns themselves will take the hit for being able to make just about anything in the Rank 4 library. We can't really justify banning 20 Rank 4 monsters due to the poor design of one deck, can we? I see where you are coming from, and I am not native in English so it is hard to explain sometimes, but Shock Master is not the problem, but just a bystander at the scene of the crime.

NeoArkadia
15th September 2015, 01:35 PM
The clowns need to burn in hell but Shockmaster is still a problem that needs to be addressed.
This is like the third~fourth time Shock's come into play as a significant nuisance.

First it was Wind-Up Loop.
Then it was Star Seraph Shaddolls & Tellarknights.
Then it was Three Ring Circus.dek

Regardless of the stupidity of the engine, the fact this thing keeps coming up every time a strong Rank 4 engine appears should be cause for concern.



We can't really justify banning 20 Rank 4 monsters due to the poor design of one deck, can we?
Why should we keep hitting 20 Rank 4 Decks due to the poor design of one card?

Tachyonic
15th September 2015, 01:47 PM
This is like the third~fourth time Shock's come into play as a significant nuisance.

First it was Wind-Up Loop.
Then it was Star Seraph Shaddolls & Tellarknights.
Then it was Three Ring Circus.dek

Regardless of the stupidity of the engine, the fact this thing keeps coming up every time a strong Rank 4 engine appears should be cause for concern.


Why should we keep hitting 20 Rank 4 Decks due to the poor design of one card?

^^This. Shock Master deserves a whack with the banstick.

Ptole deserved the ban but I thought OCG would wait a little longer. I suppose PalMage wasn't hit because (1) hitting Mascot would be too early and (2) OCG is getting BA + Beatrice, which will probably be a meta contender over there. PalMage will probably be be neutered/dead by the next banlist.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 01:49 PM
It's an interesting argument, but I have just one question.

Is Shock Master really the problem? It seems everyone agrees that it is the engine itself is what makes the card bad. Much more importantly, can't this exact argument be flipped to any card that a lot of decks use(d)?

Big Eye has been a continual issue with Rank 7 decks. You get an opponent's monster with most of the same drawbacks Shock Master has, plus the inability to attack. Why should we keep it at 3 if another Rank 7 deck could appear? Perhaps this discussion on Big Eye will return another time just as the discussion on Shock Master does.

Isn't Instant Fusion a problem, now that it is at 3? A ticking time bomb waiting for another Norden to abuse? Perhaps I am wrong, though. I just see Shock Master as not guilty of the deck being bad, even if it is not innocent as a card. A limit would do nothing, so it could only be banned, and I don't see enough reason to do it here.

Hope in the Interstice
15th September 2015, 01:52 PM
It's an interesting argument, but I have just one question.

Is Shock Master really the problem? It seems everyone agrees that it is the engine itself is what makes the card bad. Much more importantly, can't this exact argument be flipped to any card that a lot of decks use(d)?

Big Eye has been a continual issue with Rank 7 decks. You get an opponent's monster with most of the same drawbacks Shock Master has, plus the inability to attack. Why should we keep it at 3 if another Rank 7 deck could appear? Perhaps this discussion on Big Eye will return another time just as the discussion on Shock Master does.

Isn't Instant Fusion a problem, now that it is at 3? A ticking time bomb waiting for another Norden to abuse? Perhaps I am wrong, though. I just see Shock Master as not guilty of the deck being bad, even if it is not innocent as a card. A limit would do nothing, so it could only be banned, and I don't see enough reason to do it here.
You speak of 'what if's but the current reality is that Shock Master is disgusting. As NeoArkadia has pointed out, he has always been disgusting. Instant Fusion is indeed waiting for another Norden... but the fact is that there isn't another Norden right now so it's a non-issue. We'll cross these bridges when we get to them but this bridge with Shock Master is currently on fire.

Mystic TimeKeeper
15th September 2015, 01:56 PM
Shock Master should get the boot in my opinion because it prevents interactions in a game that is supposed to be played in 2 people, that should be enough to get a ban even if the card itself is not abused. Big Eye is another son of a Zexal that could go to 1 and I would be happy about that but Konami apparently makes the banlists based on tournament's results so that's not going to happen soon.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 01:58 PM
The logic presented doesn't make sense to me. Ban Shock Master despite it not being a problem if clowns go away, but other problem cards can stay. That's how I interpret your words. I don't believe that the Rank 4 speed is as toxic as clowns, which seems to be an exception, mostly due to their auto-resurrection plusses and Flame Mascot stupidity. Konami does try to learn from their mistakes with Yu-Gi-Oh, in the end. Look at how badly Zefra got nerfed because of Qlips. I get the impression I am missing something you are trying to say, and I apologize if that's the case, but I don't see why it should be the one thrown to the banlist when other cards are the bigger problem.

NeoArkadia
15th September 2015, 01:59 PM
Is Shock Master really the problem? It seems everyone agrees that it is the engine itself is what makes the card bad.
And Konami will keep on making Rank 4 engines. Rank 4 is easy to design, easy to make, easy to 'balance'.

And continuously hitting them due to these degenerate stun players seems semi nonsensical to me, when we could hit the stunning card instead.

It's logistically smarter to hit 1 card to unhit 5~6 others than it is to hit 5~6 cards to keep 1 card in the game.


Flame Mascot stupidity
There's always the argument they made Flame Mascot and pals intentionally obnoxious to force a game of chicken of "Hit the clowns or hit the Shock" with Shueisha, but you know, conspiratorial.

Flame Mascot's design in this day and age can't be coincidence.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 02:04 PM
But it is simply as you've said, the rank 4 pool is too large. They only use 1 Shock Master, and that's not the first option to go for. Hitting just Shock Master wouldn't slow down the clown deck at all.

Defensive play would instead be:

Summon Trapeze Magician, Summon Cairngorgon, Summon Traptrix Rafflesia, among others. All in the 1st turn, even without the ideal starting hand. I could see Shock Master being banned, but I simply think that's completely dodging the actual issue of a deck that rewards bad play with free summons.

NeoArkadia
15th September 2015, 02:07 PM
But it is simply as you've said, the rank 4 pool is too large. They only use 1 Shock Master, and that's not the first option to go for. Hitting just Shock Master wouldn't slow down the clown deck at all.

The problem isn't the defensive playing for most people.

The problem is the fact Shock Master shuts down your entire fucking next turn. Cards that don't let you play YGO are generally not that fun.

And why needlessly keep adding cards to the list when you could just ban Shock, and boom, less items that need to be on the List.



but I simply think that's completely dodging the actual issue of a deck that rewards bad play with free summons.
Well, that's a whole other set of issues which go back to the fact: Konami doesn't care about that. The free summons are here to stay, and you're not going to see that back off.

But there are better ways to stun the opponent that should require more work and be much more fragile.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 02:08 PM
I like what I see but it doesn't touch R4NK that much
no more infinity and instanodens though

Blue
15th September 2015, 03:12 PM
I think at this point, based on my first glance of the list, we're hitting a true tier 0 in the OCG. Everything that could stand up to Mages/Pals was hit.

Death to shock master and clowns.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 03:23 PM
I think at this point, based on my first glance of the list, we're hitting a true tier 0 in the OCG. Everything that could stand up to Mages/Pals was hit.

Death to shock master and clowns.

Now where are those idiots that kept saying "Unlock the Shock"......I REALLY want to chew their heads off

Sakuya
15th September 2015, 03:39 PM
To start off, fuck performages I'd be happy seeing the cards go the way of the eruler.While I'm not interested in the idea of outright banning shock master, I definately think at least semi-limiting it would be good, with limiting it being optimal. I don't actually know how many shock masters performages can make, but if it's 3 then fuck that shit hit the deck,2 then it's fine maybe, and if it's 1 then i guess backrow and such. But 1 is probably the least cancer way for it to go while still actually being usable. They already have their options for game 1 so they don't have to blind call, and i don't think shutting down one option of 2 if they do it first turn would be too bad since the other is also more than likely able to out it assuming that they don't go plus infinite off it. Oh wait they do. Fuck performages.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 03:40 PM
To start off, fuck performages I'd be happy seeing the cards go the way of the eruler.While I'm not interested in the idea of outright banning shock master, I definately think at least semi-limiting it would be good, with limiting it being optimal. I don't actually know how many shock masters performages can make, but if it's 3 then fuck that shit hit the deck,2 then it's fine maybe, and if it's 1 then i guess backrow and such. But 1 is probably the least cancer way for it to go while still actually being usable. They already have their options for game 1 so they don't have to blind call, and i don't think shutting down one option of 2 if they do it first turn would be too bad since the other is also more than likely able to out it assuming that they don't go plus infinite off it. Oh wait they do. Fuck performages.

Semi-limiting shock would do nothing, people only play 1. ban it or leave it

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 03:48 PM
To start off, fuck performages

-tl;dr stuff here-

Fuck performages.

Nailed it.

Anyway, Clownblade has changed how R4 spam decks work now, extending it to the fact that it's splashable in a lot of decks. I honestly think that the LP cost is enough for Clown since it burns you, but I don't know what they were thinking with letting a Level 4 being able to Special Summon itself when two or more mons are on the field, especially when most decks now swarm a lot.

One thing I'm wondering though, are Macro Cosmos and Dimensional Fissure limited in the OCG?

Tachyonic
15th September 2015, 03:48 PM
To start off, fuck performages I'd be happy seeing the cards go the way of the eruler.While I'm not interested in the idea of outright banning shock master, I definately think at least semi-limiting it would be good, with limiting it being optimal. I don't actually know how many shock masters performages can make, but if it's 3 then fuck that shit hit the deck,2 then it's fine maybe, and if it's 1 then i guess backrow and such. But 1 is probably the least cancer way for it to go while still actually being usable. They already have their options for game 1 so they don't have to blind call, and i don't think shutting down one option of 2 if they do it first turn would be too bad since the other is also more than likely able to out it assuming that they don't go plus infinite off it. Oh wait they do. Fuck performages.

Limiting Shock does nothing. You either have it legal or at 0.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 03:49 PM
Out of curiosity, how many people here actually play OCG competitively?

Thanako has said they play both. What about the rest?

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 03:54 PM
Out of curiosity, how many people here actually play OCG competitively?

Thanako has said they play both. What about the rest?

To be honest, I don't, since I mostly play online using Devpro.

From what I heard, OCG has more options on what to play than TCG's usual Nekroz, Nutellaknights, Qlips, and etc. Is it true?

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 03:58 PM
To be honest, I don't, since I mostly play online using Devpro.

From what I heard, OCG has more options on what to play than TCG's usual Nekroz, Nutellaknights, Qlips, and etc. Is it true?

ehhhhh, no. yer a little out of date on that one as those 3 stopped mattering a while back
you have clowns, clown-magicians, Clown performapals, Clown Magicians with Pals.
and occasionally Masked HERO's, nekroz and atlanteans. you won't see much else
BTW, guess which of those just got hit by this list?

oh, and Majespectres, almost forgot them
You see Clowns with Majespectres too

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 04:00 PM
To be honest, I don't, since I mostly play online using Devpro.

From what I heard, OCG has more options on what to play than TCG's usual Nekroz, Nutellaknights, Qlips, and etc. Is it true?

I'm not sure which one is considered more 'diverse.'

I'm just seeing a lot of what is seemingly spectator hate; TCG players trying to burn down decks that they have no first hand experience with. Just wondering if that's the case here, or if people do have an idea of what they're talking about.

Sakuya
15th September 2015, 04:00 PM
So my post didn't post so here it is in tl;dr

Towers and quasar work similarly to shock, resource intensive plays that force your opponent to play a certain way. Maybe shock's too easy to make and performages exemplify that, maybe performages are just god damn stupid plus infinite, either way i blame clowns.

Also i played a bit of ocg before going to tcg to play u.a.

Archfiend
15th September 2015, 04:05 PM
A moment of silence for Diva going to 1.

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 04:07 PM
ehhhhh, no. yer a little out of date on that one as those 3 stopped mattering a while back
you have clowns, clown-magicians, Clown performapals, Clown Magicians with Pals.
and occasionally Masked HERO's, nekroz and atlanteans. you won't see much else
BTW, guess which of those just got hit by this list?

oh, and Majespectres, almost forgot them
You see Clowns with Majespectres too



I'm not sure which one is considered more 'diverse.'

I'm just seeing a lot of what is seemingly spectator hate; TCG players trying to burn down decks that they have no first hand experience with. Just wondering if that's the case here, or if people do have an idea of what they're talking about.

I should probably tell you guys firsthand that I hate Majespecters with a burning passion. Immune to card destruction and targetting, searches with a normal and pend summon, and let's not forget Unicorn, and god forbid Apex Avian.

Then again with clowns I've been running clownblade a while back when Chain was still unbanned, but I found more success in a Swornblade deck (RIP JD mills though). Rarely play that at times due to its incredibly linear playstyle, and I went back to my Ojamas.


A moment of silence for Diva going to 1.

Diva's already at 1 in the TCG so there's that. Nepteabyss is the hero that Mermailnteans need and deserve though.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 04:07 PM
a moment of silence for diva going to 1.

there will be no fucking silence for her

Sakuya
15th September 2015, 04:09 PM
Bottomless at 3 tho

Archfiend
15th September 2015, 04:09 PM
there will be no fucking silence for her


didn't expect it from you, so not surprised to hear that. she will always have a place in my heart no matter how much hate she gets.

thunderlolz
15th September 2015, 04:11 PM
The consistency of the meme deck is not really affected and the shocklock and rafflesia first turn will still be a problem, even without CDI, but hopefully BA will shake things up for them

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 04:12 PM
Bottomless at 3 tho

Traptix Rafflesia is going to have so much fun

Archfiend
15th September 2015, 04:14 PM
Traptix Rafflesia is going to have so much fun

OH GOD, this didn't even cross my mind. Those poor souls in the OCG. They just can't catch a break.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 04:17 PM
OH GOD, this didn't even cross my mind. Those poor souls in the OCG. They just can't catch a break.
was wondering why you thought that was a plus...

Archfiend
15th September 2015, 04:19 PM
was wondering why you thought that was a plus...

I never thought it was a plus.

Zarafkiel
15th September 2015, 04:19 PM
Restricted:
Glow-Up Bulb


I don't even know why is this a thing when you're supposed to run it at 1 in the first place lol


Also, I'm curious as to why Kuribandit got limited to 2. Care to explain to me on this one, OCG players?

thisguy3496
15th September 2015, 04:29 PM
A moment of silence for Diva going to 1.

My sweet love getting punished in the OCG as well :mad:

kahunyu
15th September 2015, 04:36 PM
Konami almost never goes 1->3 for the OCG. Hence why things like Book and Bandit go to 2.

Basically, if something's coming off the list, they do it one increment at a time.

NeoArkadia
15th September 2015, 05:48 PM
I'm not sure which one is considered more 'diverse.'

I'm just seeing a lot of what is seemingly spectator hate; TCG players trying to burn down decks that they have no first hand experience with. Just wondering if that's the case here, or if people do have an idea of what they're talking about.
7 out of 8 Decks at the most recent Yu-Gi-Oh! Open Tournament, a major East Asian event was basically Performapal-Performage, with around 90% of their card choices the same. This was a rather large tournament on scale with a YCS, and was an official Konami event.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 05:54 PM
7 out of 8 Decks at the most recent Yu-Gi-Oh! Open Tournament, a major East Asian event was basically Performapal-Performage, with around 90% of their card choices the same. This was a rather large tournament on scale with a YCS, and was an official Konami event.

And the people who partook are probably upset about that. Or maybe they're not, who knows.

But how many of the people bitching about it in this particular thread were at that event?

Not saying you don't have a legitimate grievance, but a lot of people (not you or even anyone in particular) seem to have a personal grudge against these decks when they've not even played in the OCG meta. It comes across like mob mentality sometimes.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 06:00 PM
And the people who partook are probably upset about that. Or maybe they're not, who knows.

But how many of the people bitching about it in this particular thread were at that event?

People don't need to be directly involved with an event to care about things you know.
People are starving in Africa, people in America care.
Shit is happening in Syria, people here don't shut up about it

Same Idea, different Scale. People can care about an aspect of the franchise that doesn't directly affect them.

SynjoDeonecros
15th September 2015, 06:09 PM
I doubt Norden will be banned in the TCG, since it's so freshly out and they need it to sell tins. I hope they don't ban Ptolemaeus, though; I just got mine, and I want to try and use it in my Yosenju deck...

NeoArkadia
15th September 2015, 06:11 PM
And the people who partook are probably upset about that. Or maybe they're not, who knows.

But how many of the people bitching about it in this particular thread were at that event?
That's an awful argument. It's completely valid to not have been in high level play or the event in question, and still observe the problems of that format.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 06:17 PM
I doubt Norden will be banned in the TCG, since it's so freshly out and they need it to sell tins. I hope they don't ban Ptolemaeus, though; I just got mine, and I want to try and use it in my Yosenju deck...

We don't have Infinity here, without that the best thing he can go into is...Pleides or Knight Diamond
so no he isn't getting banned, he also won't be seeing as much use

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 06:17 PM
That's an awful argument.

It was an awful response. I asked how many people in this thread play OCG, you gave me unrelated tournament statistics, I replied to said statistics with something relevant to my original question. I repeat:


Not saying you don't have a legitimate grievance, but a lot of people (not you or even anyone in particular) seem to have a personal grudge against these decks when they've not even played in the OCG meta. It comes across like mob mentality sometimes.


It's completely valid to not have been in high level play or the event in question, and still observe the problems of that format.

Observe, yes, but this is more of "here is what, we, TCG players who have no experience actually playing in the OCG format, think should be changed about the OCG format." I'm just saying I'd prefer to hear from people who actually have experience in the format.


People don't need to be directly involved with an event to care about things you know.
People are starving in Africa, people in America care.
Shit is happening in Syria, people here don't shut up about it

Same Idea, different Scale. People can care about an aspect of the franchise that doesn't directly affect them.

Disregarding the fact that you akining a discussion about a card game to Africa and Syria is inappropriate, the difference is, the people who care usually have some idea of what's actually happening in those countries. As opposed to Yu-Gi-Oh! players.

Cheesedude
15th September 2015, 06:29 PM
Any discussion of this is going to be painted by our own biases, TCG or otherwise.

No, TCG isn't OCG, nor is DN format/playing in an OCG format online the actual OCG either.

But for most of us, that's the best we're going to get.

So we either don't discuss it at all or we accept we're biased.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 06:32 PM
Well, as long as we're admitting that we're biased...

Cheesedude
15th September 2015, 06:34 PM
I mean, I don't we can legitimately expect to have lots of people who play in an actual OCG format here. So yeah.

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 06:36 PM
I mean, I don't we can legitimately expect to have lots of people who play in an actual OCG format here. So yeah.
You never know, OCG has branched out more than a couple of years ago, but I do see your point.

Cheesedude
15th September 2015, 06:42 PM
If we get that point and have those users, then sure, we can have that conversation.

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 06:50 PM
There ARE people in the TCG regions that prefer the OCG format, Remember Lord Tyrannus?

Cheesedude
15th September 2015, 06:54 PM
I am not saying they don't exist.

I'm saying that preferring OCG format isn't actually playing in one. Its not the same thing. I don't care how many DN/YGOPro OCG format duels you do, its still not the same as playing in the proper OCG format.

Archfiend
15th September 2015, 06:59 PM
I prefer playing in the TCG/OCG pool on DN and I know for a fact its not that same as the OCG format at all. I don't think I would even want to play in that current format right now.

kahunyu
15th September 2015, 07:00 PM
I live in OCG format(Hello Asia) and the general atmosphere is "Ok this deck is great for getting me wins." but in terms of having to fucking face the deck, competitive or otherwise? Its a goddamned fucking nightmare.

This isn't some dumb spectator hate, we're looking at a fucking TIER ZERO scenario with the way they've designed the list this time. Nekroz and Heroes were two of the few things keeping EMEm barely in check. All that's left is like what, PSYFrames?

People have a goddamned reason to be pissed when there's no fucking point to buying product or playing the game when it's going to be the same old same old where first person to go wins.

I mean freaking hell it's not like EMEm is the kind of deck that has a particularly glaring flaw you can manipulate either. The anti-spell supports "Sort of" work and then that's about it. When your deck's biggest flaw is "What happens when I get Shocked" then well. Yeah.

I mean, I've been less in touch with the decks as of late but freaking hell there is literally NOTHING you can do if your opponent opens like Shock, Calls Spells or Monsters, and drops Rafflesia. If you can't see why the hell that's going to be a problem, and why the hell it's going to CONTINUE to be a problem as long as even the CONCEPT of consistent Pendulum Summoning exists, you are going to be in for a VERY rude awakening.

Shock Should've been killed alongside EMEm. Instead we're in fucking Rulers 2.0.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 07:48 PM
Out of curiosity, how many people here actually play OCG competitively?

Thanako has said they play both. What about the rest?

People have their own opinions. That's valid. But it seems like people who only know the one format are completely dismissing my understanding of both. I am not in Asia, no. But I have about 13 friends in Japan, Singapore, Malaysia, and Indonesia who all play the OCG respectively at a competitive level and play online with me. People can dismiss playing online all they want, but if you aren't using the pseudo-online "all cards" format, it is only a factor of skill.

I play for fun mostly, there's that. But I find it fun to play competitively in my circle of friends. Even someone who would go out of their way, frequenting every single officially recognized event would be biased. It is not bias to say that the clown deck is too prominent, and that hitting Shock Master alone would not stop the deck from being so speedy, though.

If you want to play competitively in the OCG, go for clowns or D/D/D. In a couple of days I would recommend Monarchs with triple And the Band Played On sided. If you can actually run that card, it just stops clowns (and most other decks) from being able to play at all. People can harp on Monarchs all they want, but they're potentially the light shining in the darkness in this situation. Side those MST though, people are buying out Zombie World and Mask of Restrict. (Not to go too off topic but they are buying TCG copies too, I think)

Everyone has an opinion. Someone who thinks that MST should be banned ultimately has as much say as you do, because ultimately that's only Konami's choice to make. I love the debates and such, but I am a bit worried that it might get carried away.

MrLucky7s
15th September 2015, 07:52 PM
People have their own opinions. That's valid. But it seems like people who only know the one format are completely dismissing my understanding of both. I am not in Asia, no. But I have about 13 friends in Japan, Singapore, Malaysia, and Indonesia who all play the OCG respectively at a competitive level and play online with me. People can dismiss playing online all they want, but if you aren't using the pseudo-online "all cards" format, it is only a factor of skill.

I play for fun mostly, there's that. But I find it fun to play competitively in my circle of friends. Even someone who would go out of their way, frequenting every single officially recognized event would be biased. It is not bias to say that the clown deck is too prominent, and that hitting Shock Master alone would not stop the deck from being so speedy, though.

If you want to play competitively in the OCG, go for clowns or D/D/D. In a couple of days I would recommend Monarchs with triple And the Band Played On sided. If you can actually run that card, it just stops clowns (and most other decks) from being able to play at all. People can harp on Monarchs all they want, but they're potentially the light shining in the darkness in this situation. Side those MST though, people are buying out Zombie World and Mask of Restrict. (Not to go too off topic but they are buying TCG copies too, I think)

Everyone has an opinion. Someone who thinks that MST should be banned ultimately has as much say as you do, because ultimately that's only Konami's choice to make. I love the debates and such, but I am a bit worried that it might get carried away.

Wow, D/D/D is competitive in the OCG?

Dread Kaiser
15th September 2015, 07:54 PM
Wow, D/D/D is competitive in the OCG?

Its made a few appearences, Its a damn good deck, just hard to use and build properly

Tamaru
15th September 2015, 08:03 PM
Everyone has an opinion. Someone who thinks that MST should be banned ultimately has as much say as you do, because ultimately that's only Konami's choice to make. I love the debates and such, but I am a bit worried that it might get carried away.

Everyone has an opinion, yes, but not everyone has an informed opinion. I want to understand the OCG position from people like you or kuhunyu who actually play the OCG game (or at least know about it through the experience of people they know), not TCG players who may or may not have a rational basis for their rage, thus I value the opinion of the former more than I do the latter (in this case). I mean, if you want to know about plumbing, you'd ask a plumber, not an electrician.

That being said, I agree with Cheesedude who said that an informed opinion might not necessarily be possible on this forum, and I accept that.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 08:25 PM
Wow, D/D/D is competitive in the OCG?

The general idea is that it works fairly well against EMEm. I would describe it as anti-meta, but when the entire meta is one deck, well... It creates some interesting possibilities. It isn't an auto-win or anything, but it is one of the few decks that can make a push against the deck, especially after this new list. Deck space is tight, you need to actually know how to play the game, and it has some issues against other decks. I'm already considering some possibilities with double Allure of Darkness, even if I'm not sure it is worth it yet. I could probably send you a build if you were interested, but I'd need some time to update it to the current format.

MrLucky7s
15th September 2015, 09:03 PM
The general idea is that it works fairly well against EMEm. I would describe it as anti-meta, but when the entire meta is one deck, well... It creates some interesting possibilities. It isn't an auto-win or anything, but it is one of the few decks that can make a push against the deck, especially after this new list. Deck space is tight, you need to actually know how to play the game, and it has some issues against other decks. I'm already considering some possibilities with double Allure of Darkness, even if I'm not sure it is worth it yet. I could probably send you a build if you were interested, but I'd need some time to update it to the current format.

Thanks for the explanation, I really hope that deck takes of with future support since it seems so interesting.

I would be very much interested in a build. I've been trying to play them for a while in the TCG/OCG format, but it's not working out. At this point I'm afraid I'm misunderstanding the deck and what's it supposed to do and considering the TCG has barely any D/D cards it's hard to find solid info on the deck.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 09:31 PM
Skeleton under new format. (http://i.imgur.com/sgziTUb.png)

Nobody can say there is a definitive build or anything, but ultimately you'd want to Fusion almost every time. It isn't simply "do this and win", so much as it is "Use what you can in this situation". Side deck is a mess, but I'll clean it up later.

I think that you'll be seeing a lot more of the deck after this list, so don't just take my word for it. Everyone seems to favor a different build that's personal to them. Part of why I love the deck myself.

Mari
15th September 2015, 09:55 PM
Always thought Ptolemaeus should have been Rank 5 (with the effect to Xyz Change to R6) instead of Rank 4. That way it's harder to bring out but Tellarknights and I'm sure other decks are still able to summon it. It's kind of a shame that they decided to make it R4 since now it will rest in the banlist until who knows how long.

I'm aware this is just OCG but I wouldn't be surprised if the same happens in the TCG once Infinity inevitably arrives.

As for the other changes I don't really have much to say except that Bubbleman, Chaos Emperor Dragon and Bottomless are very interesting choices to go directly to 3.

Thanako
15th September 2015, 10:02 PM
As for the other changes I don't really have much to say except that Bubbleman, Chaos Emperor Dragon and Bottomless are very interesting choices to go directly to 3.

Bubbleman and Bottomless were already at 2 in the OCG.


EDIT: Laughing so hard that JP players are already trying to put Informer Spider into their HERO decks and switch to EARTH attribute as the main focus. Such a random, pointless hyped card.

GodYuya
15th September 2015, 11:49 PM
So I think for at least the next 3 months:
Meta: EmEM (nearly tier 0.5), burning abyss
competitive decks: qli, tellarknights, PSYFXXXX,RB
BUT let's wait and see for a while.

thewanderlast03
16th September 2015, 12:11 AM
I like how tons of threats to BA got hit. Mist to 1 (harder to make law), Ptol banned (easy Diamond), Norden banned (easy dwellers), etc. That with the new Scrap Dragon Rank 3 xyz will make this deck even crazier than before. Shock not getting banned is kind of annoying for them though. My only real problem with this is the lack of Shock Master being banned.

Blue
16th September 2015, 02:33 AM
I didn't even notice that. OCG is definitely trying to push product if they hit all of BA's threats.

But how's the BA vs EMEm matchup? I'm not too familiar with OCG builds and playstyles.

GodYuya
16th September 2015, 04:25 AM
I like how tons of threats to BA got hit. Mist to 1 (harder to make law), Ptol banned (easy Diamond), Norden banned (easy dwellers), etc. That with the new Scrap Dragon Rank 3 xyz will make this deck even crazier than before. Shock not getting banned is kind of annoying for them though. My only real problem with this is the lack of Shock Master being banned.

All that is left is RB with their Macro Cosmos - though, there are quite a lot of ways to side against it for BAs - especially given its speed.

Zarafkiel
16th September 2015, 07:45 AM
I'd feel dumb for asking, but what's EMEm?

Hope in the Interstice
16th September 2015, 08:08 AM
I'd feel dumb for asking, but what's EMEm?
Entermates (EM) and Entermages (Em).

zuzu3371
16th September 2015, 08:54 AM
Good list after all for me, maybe EMEm will be hit next banlist

Lord Bunilla
16th September 2015, 10:39 AM
Everyone has an opinion, yes, but not everyone has an informed opinion. I want to understand the OCG position from people like you or kuhunyu who actually play the OCG game (or at least know about it through the experience of people they know), not TCG players who may or may not have a rational basis for their rage, thus I value the opinion of the former more than I do the latter (in this case). I mean, if you want to know about plumbing, you'd ask a plumber, not an electrician.

That's pretty funny, because I had the reverse scenario from a friend usually playing in the OCG. He is from South Korea (which has a different card pool, but uses the OCG List) and he went to my country after 4 years being there. Now he wanted to start playing TCG again and was talking big and loudly how the TCG is way worse than the OCG, which was when I told him to actually play (big) tournaments here, which he did, and now he thinks the OCG format is worse than the TCG, as in, the TCG is more strategic. He still uses his OCG cards (without the OCG World Premiere's tho) but builds it for the TCG format.

Hope in the Interstice
16th September 2015, 11:05 AM
Wow, D/D/D is competitive in the OCG?
Let me start off by saying that, using the reasoning he has supplied thus far, Tamaru would be in his right mind to not take this post of mine seriously as I do not play D/D. That said, I have seen it in action and it is an immensely powerful deck. However, it follows its Deal with the Devil aesthetic very well; if you screw up with D/Ds, you are in for a world of hurt. If you do well, however, you gain all the glorious power D/D provides with little of the drawbacks. It takes a calculating and skilled player to reap the best that these dark contracts offer and basically turn the tables against your genies.

From my inexperienced viewpoint, whoever achieves victory with D/D has not only defeated their opponent but also their own deck.

Tamaru
16th September 2015, 09:14 PM
That's pretty funny, because I had the reverse scenario from a friend usually playing in the OCG. He is from South Korea (which has a different card pool, but uses the OCG List) and he went to my country after 4 years being there. Now he wanted to start playing TCG again and was talking big and loudly how the TCG is way worse than the OCG, which was when I told him to actually play (big) tournaments here, which he did, and now he thinks the OCG format is worse than the TCG, as in, the TCG is more strategic. He still uses his OCG cards (without the OCG World Premiere's tho) but builds it for the TCG format.

It works both ways, TBH. It's just you see less OCG players talking trash about TCG on this side of the pond.