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Aromaiden
27th November 2015, 04:05 PM
http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/yugioh/images/7/76/SolemnNotice-BOSH-JP-SR.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/300?cb=20151016103308

Trap/Counter
When a monster(s) would be Special Summoned, OR a monster effect is activated: Pay 1500 LP; negate the Summon or activation, and if you do, destroy that card.
A combination of Divine Wrath's and Black Horn of Heaven's (Black Horn only stops the Special Summon of 1 Monster) all in one card for the price of 1500 LP. There is little reason to not run 2 to 3 copies of this card in a Deck; while its unlimited at least.

Dread Kaiser
27th November 2015, 04:19 PM
No Issues with it
All of the Issues with Ariadne

Aromaiden
27th November 2015, 04:29 PM
Cards like Ariadne and Flame Mascot (especially this one) are just terrible design in general for Pendulum Monsters. Anyways, from what I can tell, in the OCG, Ariadne has fallen out of favor but powerful stun cards like Notice are still run in each deck (at least 1 copy).

Dread Kaiser
27th November 2015, 04:32 PM
there are some cards that should simply never be searchable, Any counter trap is topping that list

Aromaiden
27th November 2015, 04:37 PM
Tell that to Konami. It baffles me how they can make overly balanced and restricted cards like Watch Dog and then later end up making stupidly designed cards like Ariadne, who searches some of the most powerful traps in the game.

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 04:38 PM
I hate this card. Burn it.
Kills several Special Summons when at the same time, like Pendulum Summon.
Doesn't negate Normal Summons, though. But who cares? Just wait for it to activate its effects.
Also, if a monster's Summon cannot be negated (or is Special Summoned by a card effect), well, just wait for it to activate its effects.
And all at the simple price of 1500 LP.
Above all, searchable by that annoying Ariadne.
Conclusion: to hell with it.

Jakinus
27th November 2015, 09:21 PM
I don't really have a problem with the card, I actually like it but it came at an odd time and in an odd shape. Almost every new archetype have their own counter trap, some of them more powerful than others, but their own counter traps nonetheless. If this card's purpose is to counter pendulums then why add that negation effect? There's also Great Horn of Heaven that was recently released and OCG have both Solemns limited and a lot of backrow unlimited. And then there's Ariadne but that's another topic.

I dunno, it looks kinda like an overkill to me. The card exists and it's most likely that it will get hit in a couple of formats after realease so why not use it while we can?

I know that a lot of players have this "moral code" to not use this card because it's stupid and blablabla and they'll make sure you know but I don't give two sh*ts what they think are the "good ways". When this card come to the TCG I'm going to splash at least 2 Notices and 1 Warning in every deck I have.

Drakylon
27th November 2015, 09:49 PM
I hate all the Solemn traps. Kills too much for too little cost. And yes, half your LP is too little cost for negating virtually anything in the game. Ariadne just exacerbates the issue with Solemns, making them even more reliable.

In my opinion, extreme splashability (i.e. run it in every deck just because it exists) is a sign of bad card design as it doesn't bring anything positive to deckbuilding. There's a reason why Pot of Greed, Graceful Charity and the like were banned.

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 09:55 PM
And yes, half your LP is too little cost for negating virtually anything in the game.

Half LP as a cost means you can (almost) always pay it.

Mystic TimeKeeper
27th November 2015, 09:58 PM
Half LP as a cost means you can (almost) always pay it.

Take almost out, even 1 has an half if we want to be strict about it.

I'm in general against cards that do too much alone for too little or "cockblock cards", and this kinda belongs to both categories so here you go. Sadly it exist so we got to deal with it, I'll probably stick with Divine Wrath though because this thing isn't going to be less than ultra if Warning or Scolding are of any indication.

Sanokal
27th November 2015, 10:04 PM
Take almost out, even 1 has an half if we want to be strict about it.

I'm in general against cards that do too much alone for too little or "cockblock cards", and this kinda belongs to both categories so here you go. Sadly it exist so we got to deal with it, I'll probably stick with Divine Wrath though because this thing isn't going to be less than ultra if Warning or Scolding are of any indication.

Oh goodness no. That being said, with that new rarity system being put in place for BOSH, it might be slightly easier for us to pull than in the old system.

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 10:08 PM
Take almost out, even 1 has an half if we want to be strict about it.

I used almost because I'm not sure of what happens if the user has, let's say, 525 LP, for instance.


I'm in general against cards that do too much alone for too little or "cockblock cards", and this kinda belongs to both categories so here you go. Sadly it exist so we got to deal with it, I'll probably stick with Divine Wrath though because this thing isn't going to be less than ultra if Warning or Scolding are of any indication.

I hate this Negate Summons cards. They are just to screw the opponent.
And it will probably be a Secret Rare.
I have my hopes on a non Secret Twin Twister. But looking at Galaxy Cyclone...

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 10:14 PM
Oh goodness no. That being said, with that new rarity system being put in place for BOSH, it might be slightly easier for us to pull than in the old system.

Ah yes. I hope you're right. I buy single cards, though. How do you think the prices will be influenced?

Jolan
27th November 2015, 10:15 PM
If this is a Solemn counter trap, it should either be at 1 or 0.
Like how Pendulum pointed out, it's really special mostly because it can still pop monsters whose summon can't be negated. Just wait for it to activate its effect and respond.
1500 LP and not limited to 1 means it's outright better than Warning. Warning stops both inherent and non-inherent summons but Notice stops non-inherent coming from monsters so what is the only advantage of Warning?
It can stop non-inherent coming from spells and traps. Most of the time, from a trap, it would be a Call or Oasis, which would be done to activate the monster's effect. Notice wins here. For Spells, now, that would be a strong reason for Warning to win. If it's a fusion card, even if the monster has an effect for Notice to negate, you don't want to allow the opponent to dump the fusion materials. It's too helpful for them.
Overall, Notice seems like a bigger winner than Warning and you can have 3 of it.
It has to get limited ASAP.

Dread Kaiser
27th November 2015, 10:20 PM
I know that a lot of players have this "moral code" to not use this card because it's stupid and blablabla and they'll make sure you know but I don't give two sh*ts what they think are the "good ways". When this card come to the TCG I'm going to splash at least 2 Notices and 1 Warning in every deck I have.

Honestly its really just mofiz and a few others that has a thing against Counter-traps and Solemns
Its Floodgates that have near universal hate here

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I used almost because I'm not sure of what happens if the user has, let's say, 525 LP, for instance.

You round up

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Honestly they should just print "you can only use Solemn X once per duel" the next time they make a solemn counter, they all end up @1 or 0 anyway

Jolan
27th November 2015, 10:22 PM
Oh, right, we have TCG which hates us and will up it to an Ultra rare at least. Hm. I really wish rarity bumps didn't happen for us but with Notice being Super Rare in OCG, and TCG having 1 super rare per pack guaranteed, I would hope it doesn't stick. Just don't throw it into Secret Rare territory like Galaxy Cyclone.
I actually wanted to use Galaxy Cyclone, like a cool MST replacement for some decks, but at 35$ per card, I just can't afford it.

Dread Kaiser
27th November 2015, 10:30 PM
1500 LP and not limited to 1 means it's outright better than Warning. Warning stops both inherent and non-inherent summons but Notice stops non-inherent coming from monsters so what is the only advantage of Warning?

Other way around, Notice can only stop Inherent summons (IE pendulum, Synchro, Xyz and Cyber dragon-like stuff) and Non-inherent-Monster effect summons.
Any Fusion, ritual or anything Revived has to use its effect before this can kill it, and some things, like say Midrash, have only continous effects on the field or can't die by card effects (so you could negate a Majespecter, but it wouldn't die)

Further, monsters who get hit but the Divine Wrath effect didn't have their summons negated, meaning any Field-to-Grave Floats will trigger and be revived later

Warning Stops all summons, Unless its a God it doesn't matter how, when or what summons it, it dies and doesn't come back.

Example, Shaddolls. Shadoll Fusion is activated, going for Construct.
Construct is summoned, Notice Kills it when it triggers. Shaddoll Player says "K" and gets their Fusion spell back and maybe revive it with Falco later.
Warning Kills Fusion, Construct stays in the extra, Fusion material doesn't go to grave, no Floats trigger.

Warning is less Versitile, but is still the best card in the "Stops summoning" Department.
Which one is better? Thats kinda match-up dependant, but generally yeah Notice will be the better card for versitility reasons...

Jakinus
27th November 2015, 10:39 PM
Honestly its really just mofiz and a few others that has a thing against Counter-traps and Solemns
Its Floodgates that have near universal hate here

I was talking about the community in general. There was this guy in DN that PREACHED me, I'm not kidding. He also told me that he was drunk at the time, I wonder if that have somethig to do?

Floodgates and I have a love-hate relationship. I play a lot of Aggro decks so floodgates are, most of the time, the bane of my existence. But I also found a way to main deck Mistake in EMEm ... For the lulz.

Dread Kaiser
27th November 2015, 10:51 PM
I was talking in general. There was this guy in DN that PREACHED me, I'm not kidding. He also told me that he was drunk at the time, I wonder if that have somethig to do?

Floodgates and I have a love-hate relationship. I play a lot of Aggro decks so floodgates are, most of the time, the bane of my existence. But I also find a way to main deck Mistake in ... For the lulz.

+1 reason to not go back to DN for me
I know that feeling, same thing with me for a few cards
Like REDMD, Biggest, Baddest Red-eyes Evolution. and its just a generic Dragon card when everything about it just screams "Super-Boss Monster" so it feels horribly out of place with how Splashable it is

Whenever I run my Blue-eyes deck, I see this Red-eyes card and think "This shouldn't be here"

Sanokal
27th November 2015, 10:55 PM
Ah yes. I hope you're right. I buy single cards, though. How do you think the prices will be influenced?

Ergh, hopefully it won't be anyway near Dante's price. Should stay just below $50, but take note that I'm talking NZ$ here, and also have little experience with pricing cards.

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 10:57 PM
Honestly its really just mofiz and a few others that has a thing against Counter-traps and Solemns
Its Floodgates that have near universal hate here

I hate floodgates and the Solemns. Damn, Dread, I try to do something first turn, Solemned. Second try, BTH. Third, TT. Finally I was able to do something and am going for a big play, Vanity's. I play a deck with 33 monsters, SD.
What the hell can I do. I just hate those cards.



You round up

Thank you.


Honestly they should just print "you can only use Solemn X once per duel" the next time they make a solemn counter, they all end up @1 or 0 anyway

Once per duel wouldn't be enough. They have to be limited and non searchable. In my opinion, of course.

AccelRainbowDashley
27th November 2015, 11:37 PM
We got an upgraded MST, so it makes sense we'd also get an upgraded Solemn. I wouldn't be at all surprised if there was more upgrades to older cards in the coming set.

As for the card itself, I saw similar complaints when Warning was first revealed so this is all deja-vu for me. Speaking in strictly neutral terms, this is a very good card. It gets around those pesky monsters who's summon cannot be negated, by negating any non-continuous effects it may have, while also dealing with many of the same threats Warning did. Not all of them, but most. Certainly enough to be considered a staple.

Does it make the game harder? Sure, but that's part of the fun. I'm probably in the minority with that opinion, though.

Pendulum
27th November 2015, 11:42 PM
We got an upgraded MST, so it makes sense we'd also get an upgraded Solemn. I wouldn't be at all surprised if there was more upgrades to older cards in the coming set.

No it doesn't. By that logic, everytime a MST-like card comes out, we should get another Solemn. And Solemns are way more powerful than MST-like cards.


As for the card itself, I saw similar complaints when Warning was first revealed so this is all deja-vu for me. Speaking in strictly neutral terms, this is a very good card. It gets around those pesky monsters who's summon cannot be negated, by negating any non-continuous effects it may have, while also dealing with many of the same threats Warning did. Not all of them, but most. Certainly enough to be considered a staple.

Does it make the game harder? Sure, but that's part of the fun. I'm probably in the minority with that opinion, though.

It doesn't make the game harder, it makes it more impossible. And that's not part of the fun. That's removing the fun part of it, actually. But yeah, it's a very good card, of course.

AccelRainbowDashley
27th November 2015, 11:52 PM
No it doesn't. By that logic, everytime a MST-like card comes out, we should get another Solemn. And Solemns are way more powerful than MST-like cards.



It doesn't make the game harder, it makes it more impossible. And that's not part of the fun. That's removing the fun part of it, actually. But yeah, it's a very good card, of course.

Twin Twister is a straight upgrade to MST. The discard may hurt some decks more than others but at it's core it's meant to replace MST. Between Galaxy Cyclone and Twin Twister, MST has become mostly obsolete.

Saying the game is "more impossible" doesn't make any sense, and for some people, like me, it's more fun when the game isn't easy. I take pride in being able to adapt to all the new cards and continue winning at least as much as I always have. So I guess if I'm still winning when the game is 'more impossible' I must be amazing.


I actually am pretty goddamn amazing

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:04 AM
Twin Twister is a straight upgrade to MST. The discard may hurt some decks more than others but at it's core it's meant to replace MST. Between Galaxy Cyclone and Twin Twister, MST has become mostly obsolete.

... I know that. I think that's what I said.


Saying the game is "more impossible" doesn't make any sense, and for some people, like me, it's more fun when the game isn't easy. I take pride in being able to adapt to all the new cards and continue winning at least as much as I always have. So I guess if I'm still winning when the game is 'more impossible' I must be amazing.

Well, I take pride in facing a hard game as well. The keyword being facing. Being able to do nothing is not facing.


I actually am pretty goddamn amazing

Nice to know. I'm too, pleasure to meet you.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 12:09 AM
No it doesn't. By that logic, everytime a MST-like card comes out, we should get another Solemn. And Solemns are way more powerful than MST-like cards.



It doesn't make the game harder, it makes it more impossible. And that's not part of the fun. That's removing the fun part of it, actually. But yeah, it's a very good card, of course.

Don't waste your time on her. She thinks she is some overpro because she played goat format, yet I saw often enough that she has no idea of the current metas.

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Even more overpowered than Solemn Warning and that card is limited for a reason. It kills any monster action for a non existent cost, making it simply overpowered or even broken. No surprise people run 3 of it and sometimes not even Warning.

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Honestly its really just mofiz and a few others that has a thing against Counter-traps and Solemns
Its Floodgates that have near universal hate here

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You round up

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Honestly they should just print "you can only use Solemn X once per duel" the next time they make a solemn counter, they all end up @1 or 0 anyway

Where is the point in limiting cards if you make an almost replica that gets limited anyway? You could aswell keep 3 warnings.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:12 AM
You could aswell keep 3 warnings.

Hell no! Even regarding its context, don't say that. Konami may be watching.

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 12:15 AM
Well, I take pride in facing a hard game as well. The keyword being facing. Being able to do nothing is not facing.[/spoiler]

But you're not unable to do anything. That's what I'm trying to explain to you. The game is still 100% playable.

Jolan
28th November 2015, 12:17 AM
Other way around, Notice can only stop Inherent summons (IE pendulum, Synchro, Xyz and Cyber dragon-like stuff) and Non-inherent-Monster effect summons.
Any Fusion, ritual or anything Revived has to use its effect before this can kill it, and some things, like say Midrash, have only continous effects on the field or can't die by card effects (so you could negate a Majespecter, but it wouldn't die)

Further, monsters who get hit but the Divine Wrath effect didn't have their summons negated, meaning any Field-to-Grave Floats will trigger and be revived later

Warning Stops all summons, Unless its a God it doesn't matter how, when or what summons it, it dies and doesn't come back.

Example, Shaddolls. Shadoll Fusion is activated, going for Construct.
Construct is summoned, Notice Kills it when it triggers. Shaddoll Player says "K" and gets their Fusion spell back and maybe revive it with Falco later.
Warning Kills Fusion, Construct stays in the extra, Fusion material doesn't go to grave, no Floats trigger.

Warning is less Versitile, but is still the best card in the "Stops summoning" Department.
Which one is better? Thats kinda match-up dependant, but generally yeah Notice will be the better card for versitility reasons...
Pretty much what I said, but I think I wrote it wrong about the ''inherent'' bit, haha. Warning has an advantage over Notice because it stops Spells and Traps, so it would kill things like Shadoll Fusion and Polymerization, but Notice can be run at 3, which makes up for that a LOT.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:18 AM
But you're not unable to do anything. That's what I'm trying to explain to you. The game is still 100% playable.

You didn't explain anything, actually.
Yeah, I normal summon, and get my monster solemned... I can normal summon, indeed, but...
I just can't face those cards beacuse they cover almost everything.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 12:25 AM
Don't waste your time on her. She thinks she is some overpro because she played goat format, yet I saw often enough that she has no idea of the current metas.
Let's not. There's no need for this bitterness from anyone.

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 12:26 AM
You didn't explain anything, actually.
Yeah, I normal summon, and get my monster solemned... I can normal summon, indeed, but...
I just can't face those cards beacuse they cover almost everything.

It can happen, but it won't always happen. Doesn't mean the game is unplayable.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 12:30 AM
Let's not. There's no need for this bitterness from anyone.

Just warning him. I got the exact threatment of her many many times and arguing is just not worth it. Also I'm just saying facts in this case.
Not that I have to add anything to this.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:31 AM
It can happen, but it won't always happen. Doesn't mean the game is unplayable.

It happens more than it should, though.
And I play this game for a long time. And it happens way more than I would like. It's just awful when I get Solemned, then BTH, then Solemned, then "hey I normal summoned, let me activate my monster's effect", solemned again.
It's annoying, you can't perform your plays. You can't even start them.
You say you're goddamn good. How good then? What can you do to avoid this?

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 12:42 AM
It happens more than it should, though.
And I play this game for a long time. And it happens way more than I would like. It's just awful when I get Solemned, then BTH, then Solemned, then "hey I normal summoned, let me activate my monster's effect", solemned again.
It's annoying, you can't perform your plays. You can't even start them.
You say you're goddamn good. How good then? What can you do to avoid this?

Twin Twister and Denko are some options.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:43 AM
Twin Twister and Denko are some options.

No. Denko's normal summon can be negated. You sure you're goddamn good?

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 12:48 AM
No. Denko's normal summon can be negated. You sure you're goddamn good?

It can be negated by the single Warning people are allowed, that not everyone runs anymore. It's an acceptable risk. Nothing is perfect but if you keep worrying about the single card out someone has, you'll never enjoy the game.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 12:53 AM
It can be negated by the single Warning people are allowed, that not everyone runs anymore. It's an acceptable risk. Nothing is perfect but if you keep worrying about the single card out someone has, you'll never enjoy the game.

Wait what?

that not everyone runs anymore
You sure?


but if you keep worrying about the single card out someone has, you'll never enjoy the game.
It's not the single card. It's the combination of those single cards that takes out the fun.
I do enjoy the game when I play against some very cool and creative decks, because they pull awesome combos and I'm able to counterattack, because I'm able to play my combos too.
Now if I'm facing a deck committed to disrupt the start of any of my plays, well... How can I enjoy it if I can't even use my deck properly?

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 12:56 AM
You sure?
Yeah, some people neglect Solemn Warning.


It's not the single card. It's the combination of those single cards that takes out the fun.
I do enjoy the game when I play against some very cool and creative decks, because they pull awesome combos and I'm able to counterattack, because I'm able to play my combos too.
Now if I'm facing a deck committed to disrupt the start of any of my plays, well... How can I enjoy it if I can't even use my deck properly?
People drawing a hand's worth of entire summon negation are as likely as you drawing into all the cards you need for your awesome combos. It's really not worth worrying about outside of those instances.

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 01:01 AM
Wait what?

You sure?


It's not the single card. It's the combination of those single cards that takes out the fun.
I do enjoy the game when I play against some very cool and creative decks, because they pull awesome combos and I'm able to counterattack, because I'm able to play my combos too.
Now if I'm facing a deck committed to disrupt the start of any of my plays, well... How can I enjoy it if I can't even use my deck properly?

That doesn't happen in every single duel unless you constantly play against top-tier decks. I only play against friends anymore because I get exactly what you want: fun games with crazy combos and none of that youcan'tplay.dek nonsense.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 01:04 AM
People drawing a hand's worth of entire summon negation are as likely as you drawing into all the cards you need for your awesome combos. It's really not worth worrying about outside of those instances.

It may be hard, but it's too easy nonetheless. And now it's even searchable. It annoys me, you know? I'm trying to perform my plays, and I just can't. I just can't. I think it's not fair. You either run a deck which contains cards like those or counters to them, or you're toasted. And I don't want to fill about 20%-25% of my deck with cards just to counter another cards just becasue they're too powerful. It shouldn't work that way. People should be able to play their decks and to build them as they want.

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That doesn't happen in every single duel unless you constantly play against top-tier decks. I only play against friends anymore because I get exactly what you want: fun games with crazy combos and none of that youcan'tplay.dek nonsense.

So you agree with me, then. It happens more than it should. It's a good card, but I would never use it because I want to face my opponent's deck. I want to see their strategy, enjoy it, and try to battle it with my deck. Not just disrupt their first play and then wreck them.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 01:18 AM
It may be hard, but it's too easy nonetheless. And now it's even searchable. It annoys me, you know? I'm trying to perform my plays, and I just can't. I just can't. I think it's not fair. You either run a deck which contains cards like those or counters to them, or you're toasted. And I don't want to fill about 20%-25% of my deck with cards just to counter another cards just becasue they're too powerful. It shouldn't work that way. People should be able to play their decks and to build them as they want.
You make it sound like it happens every single duel, which strikes me as very odd since it's still only a somewhat common occurrence with me. It's like all you ever do is go against decks that maximise those cards.

Jolan
28th November 2015, 01:23 AM
I would like to mention that even tho Warning is technically searchable via Ariadne, Ariadne's effect is ''Confirm 3 Opp picks 1'' so you can always pick the Notice over the Warning and then just normal summon your (unsearchable) Denko.

AccelRainbowDashley
28th November 2015, 01:25 AM
It may be hard, but it's too easy nonetheless. And now it's even searchable. It annoys me, you know? I'm trying to perform my plays, and I just can't. I just can't. I think it's not fair. You either run a deck which contains cards like those or counters to them, or you're toasted. And I don't want to fill about 20%-25% of my deck with cards just to counter another cards just becasue they're too powerful. It shouldn't work that way. People should be able to play their decks and to build them as they want.

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So you agree with me, then. It happens more than it should. It's a good card, but I would never use it because I want to face my opponent's deck. I want to see their strategy, enjoy it, and try to battle it with my deck. Not just disrupt their first play and then wreck them.

I never disagreed with you in the first place, honestly. I just always look for the ways to counter problems. No, I won't always draw my counters but it doesn't mean it's worthless. I guess I'm just overly positive about the game.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 01:37 AM
Yeah, some people neglect Solemn Warning.


People drawing a hand's worth of entire summon negation are as likely as you drawing into all the cards you need for your awesome combos. It's really not worth worrying about outside of those instances.

Yeah... only that a forth of your deck is filled with that. Believe me, it happens more often than you think. I have less problems with them since Power Rangers double Fish came out but still bs.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 02:24 AM
Yeah... only that a forth of your deck is filled with that. Believe me, it happens more often than you think. I have less problems with them since Power Rangers double Fish came out but still bs.
I know how often it happens. It sucks every time it happens but I know it doesn't happen as often as you and Pendulum make it seem.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 02:29 AM
I know how often it happens. It sucks every time it happens but I know it doesn't happen as often as you and Pendulum make it seem.

Depends on what you play against. Tellars, Majes, Clowns and BA do start a lot with those. And even if not with 5 at once, 1 or 2 of them is already frustrating. There is simply no reason that this should be possible at ALL. Why have a single card that can make all situations suck, it's not even a combo, you just have to sack it out. There is no point in having a card like that allowed. We could aswell get a Judgment back at 1 and there are good reasons to not do that.

Thanako
28th November 2015, 02:37 AM
Every worthwhile Solemn card eventually goes to 2, and then 1. Maybe in this case it will go straight to 1. I have to consider we are talking about the OCG format here, of course. I know that Judgement is (unjustly) banned in the TCG, but it is still at 1 in the OCG like Warning.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 02:52 AM
Every worthwhile Solemn card eventually goes to 2, and then 1. Maybe in this case it will go straight to 1. I have to consider we are talking about the OCG format here, of course. I know that Judgement is (unjustly) banned in the TCG, but it is still at 1 in the OCG like Warning.
How is Judgement unjustly banned? It can negate everything anytime you want.

Thanako
28th November 2015, 03:09 AM
How is Judgement unjustly banned? It can negate everything anytime you want.

If you use Solemn Judgement, you are going to pay for it. And yes, it negates a lot, but the speed of the game itself arguably made Solemn Warning a much better card. And ultimately with Solemn Notice being a thing, the card really struggles to find its niche outside of being a counter-trap. With the game far more focused on Summoning, and every deck getting a themed card that works nearly as well, we come at an impasse. Yes, it is generic, but as far as the meta goes, it really doesn't see much play, especially since it has such a steep cost, unless you use it late in the game.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 03:16 AM
If you use Solemn Judgement, you are going to pay for it. And yes, it negates a lot, but the speed of the game itself arguably made Solemn Warning a much better card. And ultimately with Solemn Notice being a thing, the card really struggles to find its niche outside of being a counter-trap. With the game far more focused on Summoning, and every deck getting a themed card that works nearly as well, we come at an impasse. Yes, it is generic, but as far as the meta goes, it really doesn't see much play, especially since it has such a steep cost, unless you use it late in the game.

"Paying for it" with Life Points isn't really paying at all. For the reward of getting rid of literally anything that could beat or disturb you, it is totally worth the cost. It can be always played, as opposed to the other Solemns and it can do more than other Counter Traps, including Archtype build ins. And how doesn't it see play in meta. Everyone runs a copy of it.
This game is based on monsters, but monsters are more than just summoning them. It's using their effects. And with pendulums being a thing, the effect can even prevent Luster shenanigans.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 03:17 AM
"Paying for it" with Life Points isn't really paying at all. For the reward of getting rid of literally anything that could beat or disturb you, it is totally worth the cost. It can be always played, as opposed to the other Solemns and it can do way more than any other Counter Trap, including Archtype build ins. And how doesn't it see play in meta. Everyone runs a copy of it.
I'd like to add to this by saying that a single A Hero Lives has resulted in my loss from turn 1 thanks to Dark Law.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 03:20 AM
I'd like to add to this by saying that a single A Hero Lives has resulted in my loss from turn 1 thanks to Dark Law.

My opponent started with 4 face-downs and drew into AHL... It was one of the biggest middle fingers I've seen.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 03:22 AM
My opponent started with 4 face-downs and drew into AHL... It was one of the biggest middle fingers I've seen.
You know what? I'd prefer Solemn Warning. I'd prefer Bottomless. What I cannot stand is using Mask Change to go into another Dark Law. It's like when Shaddolls use El Shaddoll Fusion to go into another Construct. Please, I'm willing to put up with one but just one.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 03:25 AM
You know what? I'd prefer Solemn Warning. I'd prefer Bottomless. What I cannot stand is using Mask Change to go into another Dark Law. It's like when Shaddolls use El Shaddoll Fusion to go into another Construct. Please, I'm willing to put up with one but just one.

Solemns: Cockblocking once, making you disadvantage by 1-2.
Dark Law: Discouraging you to add which is already a lot of disadvantage in most cases, killing off your graveyard which is even more disadvantaging and then that fucker can release escape into a copy of itself and use the search block AGAIN. Dude....

Indytotof
28th November 2015, 07:34 AM
Dark Law: Discouraging you to add which is already a lot of disadvantage in most cases, killing off your graveyard which is even more disadvantaging and then that fucker can release escape into a copy of itself and use the search block AGAIN. Dude....

Archfiend Black Skull or even more generic, Utopia the Lightning. Problem solved.

Dark Law is way to fragile to be considered a threat.

Hope in the Interstice
28th November 2015, 07:43 AM
Archfiend Black Skull or even more generic, Utopia the Lightning. Problem solved.

Dark Law is way to fragile to be considered a threat.
Archfiend Black Skull Dragon is only used by one deck, and that's if they're opting to use him at all.

Anyway, Dark Law neuters Pendulum Decks and any deck that relies on the Graveyard, not to mention he cuts off searching. By the time you do manage to get rid of him, if at all, you've suffered a tremendous loss of resources. My Qliphorts struggled endlessly against this guy time and time again.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 07:53 AM
You make it sound like it happens every single duel, which strikes me as very odd since it's still only a somewhat common occurrence with me. It's like all you ever do is go against decks that maximise those cards.

I had to go to sleep, so...
It happens more than I would like to. And it's such a bad way to counter your opponent it annoys me too much.
Mofiz already explained you the point, I guess.

Pendulum
28th November 2015, 07:59 AM
Every worthwhile Solemn card eventually goes to 2, and then 1. Maybe in this case it will go straight to 1. I have to consider we are talking about the OCG format here, of course. I know that Judgement is (unjustly) banned in the TCG, but it is still at 1 in the OCG like Warning.

(unjustly)

Negate everything everytime whenever you want. You'll always have LP to cut.

Mofiz
28th November 2015, 11:21 AM
Archfiend Black Skull or even more generic, Utopia the Lightning. Problem solved.

Dark Law is way to fragile to be considered a threat.

Black Deamons is one of the most irrelevant cards that ever existed and can only be used by one Deck alone.
S39 is the cheapest counter that existed, I could aswell go OCG and play Shock and it's for Rank 4 Decks only. Not to mention that until you summoned and used S39, you already made immense disadvantage and your opponent will just summon a new Mist.
And ffs, how often do we have to say that counters don't make anything less overpowered?

Thanako
29th November 2015, 04:04 PM
"Paying for it" with Life Points isn't really paying at all. For the reward of getting rid of literally anything that could beat or disturb you, it is totally worth the cost. It can be always played, as opposed to the other Solemns and it can do more than other Counter Traps, including Archtype build ins. And how doesn't it see play in meta. Everyone runs a copy of it.
This game is based on monsters, but monsters are more than just summoning them. It's using their effects. And with pendulums being a thing, the effect can even prevent Luster shenanigans.

The effect of Solemn Judgement speaks for itself:

When a monster would be Summoned, OR a Spell/Trap Card is activated: Pay half your Life Points; negate the Summon or activation, and if you do, destroy that card.


I don't know why you are bringing up Monster Effects here. It is not the "no" card that you all remember. It is an insanely easy to play around card that has led to just as many duel losses as wins for using it. I can also show you all of the current EMEm decks if you like, of which run Solemn Notice but not Judgement.


Negate everything everytime whenever you want. You'll always have LP to cut.

I already showed you the effect as a refresher. I am sorry to say, but you're wrong with it "negating everything". If that were true, we wouldn't have many, many other Solemn cards. Yes, it can be quite potent and can even handle Normal Summons, but implying it can negate everything is wrong. It is a god-awful card early on, even if never technically "dead". Halving your LP might not matter turn 15, but ultimately look at the speed of the game right now. With every meta deck loving the OTK, making it half the work for them isn't really a smart idea.

Mofiz
29th November 2015, 04:19 PM
The effect of Solemn Judgement speaks for itself:

When a monster would be Summoned, OR a Spell/Trap Card is activated: Pay half your Life Points; negate the Summon or activation, and if you do, destroy that card.


I don't know why you are bringing up Monster Effects here. It is not the "no" card that you all remember. It is an insanely easy to play around card that has led to just as many duel losses as wins for using it. I can also show you all of the current EMEm decks if you like, of which run Solemn Notice but not Judgement.



I already showed you the effect as a refresher. I am sorry to say, but you're wrong with it "negating everything". If that were true, we wouldn't have many, many other Solemn cards. Yes, it can be quite potent and can even handle Normal Summons, but implying it can negate everything is wrong. It is a god-awful card early on, even if never technically "dead". Halving your LP might not matter turn 15, but ultimately look at the speed of the game right now. With every meta deck loving the OTK, making it half the work for them isn't really a smart idea.

Easy to play around. So is every other card not called shock. But I guess "counters dont justify anything broken " is still something people dont get.
If you have mst, good. How about we get every other banned spell or trap back then.
If you mean it is easy to bait it out. Yes, if your opponent is a moron. No one who knows what he is doing will blindly use this on a medio core card that isnt worth it.

Also, ofcourse people run notice over jusgment in Emems. That's obvious. They only need three copies of the one card they want because else the opponent will choose judgment. With beast negating every spell during each turn, your only threat are monsters so you will use that of course. Usage of this card in Emems doesnt Show how good either it, it Shows how good they are in THEIR deck.
Not like comparing the card they ran forever, to another, possibly worse one, is an Argument to justify it

Mofiz
29th November 2015, 04:19 PM
The effect of Solemn Judgement speaks for itself:

When a monster would be Summoned, OR a Spell/Trap Card is activated: Pay half your Life Points; negate the Summon or activation, and if you do, destroy that card.


I don't know why you are bringing up Monster Effects here. It is not the "no" card that you all remember. It is an insanely easy to play around card that has led to just as many duel losses as wins for using it. I can also show you all of the current EMEm decks if you like, of which run Solemn Notice but not Judgement.



I already showed you the effect as a refresher. I am sorry to say, but you're wrong with it "negating everything". If that were true, we wouldn't have many, many other Solemn cards. Yes, it can be quite potent and can even handle Normal Summons, but implying it can negate everything is wrong. It is a god-awful card early on, even if never technically "dead". Halving your LP might not matter turn 15, but ultimately look at the speed of the game right now. With every meta deck loving the OTK, making it half the work for them isn't really a smart idea.

Easy to play around. So is every other card not called shock. But I guess "counters dont justify anything broken " is still something people dont get.
If you have mst, good. How about we get every other banned spell or trap back then.
If you mean it is easy to bait it out. Yes, if your opponent is a moron. No one who knows what he is doing will blindly use this on a medio core card that isnt worth it.

Also, ofcourse people run notice over jusgment in Emems. That's obvious. They only need three copies of the one card they want because else the opponent will choose judgment. With beast negating every spell during each turn, your only threat are monsters so you will use that of course. Usage of this card in Emems doesnt Show how good either it, it Shows how good they are in THEIR deck.
Not like comparing the card they ran forever, to another, possibly worse one, is an Argument to justify it

- - - Updated - - -


The effect of Solemn Judgement speaks for itself:

When a monster would be Summoned, OR a Spell/Trap Card is activated: Pay half your Life Points; negate the Summon or activation, and if you do, destroy that card.


I don't know why you are bringing up Monster Effects here. It is not the "no" card that you all remember. It is an insanely easy to play around card that has led to just as many duel losses as wins for using it. I can also show you all of the current EMEm decks if you like, of which run Solemn Notice but not Judgement.



I already showed you the effect as a refresher. I am sorry to say, but you're wrong with it "negating everything". If that were true, we wouldn't have many, many other Solemn cards. Yes, it can be quite potent and can even handle Normal Summons, but implying it can negate everything is wrong. It is a god-awful card early on, even if never technically "dead". Halving your LP might not matter turn 15, but ultimately look at the speed of the game right now. With every meta deck loving the OTK, making it half the work for them isn't really a smart idea.

Easy to play around. So is every other card not called shock. But I guess "counters dont justify anything broken " is still something people dont get.
If you have mst, good. How about we get every other banned spell or trap back then.
If you mean it is easy to bait it out. Yes, if your opponent is a moron. No one who knows what he is doing will blindly use this on a medio core card that isnt worth it.

Also, ofcourse people run notice over jusgment in Emems. That's obvious. They only need three copies of the one card they want because else the opponent will choose judgment. With beast negating every spell during each turn, your only threat are monsters so you will use that of course. Usage of this card in Emems doesnt Show how good either it, it Shows how good they are in THEIR deck.
Not like comparing the card they ran forever, to another, possibly worse one, is an Argument to justify it

Dread Kaiser
29th November 2015, 04:26 PM
Whats with all teh doubleposting.....

Mofiz
29th November 2015, 04:36 PM
Whats with all teh doubleposting.....

I cant Access org on my PC so im Using my mobile. It Tends to do that

- - - Updated - - -


Whats with all teh doubleposting.....

I cant Access org on my PC so im Using my mobile. It Tends to do that

Pendulum
29th November 2015, 06:50 PM
I already showed you the effect as a refresher. I am sorry to say, but you're wrong with it "negating everything". If that were true, we wouldn't have many, many other Solemn cards.

You know? I keep asking myself why do we have so many other Solemn cards, yes.


Yes, it can be quite potent and can even handle Normal Summons, but implying it can negate everything is wrong. It is a god-awful card early on, even if never technically "dead". Halving your LP might not matter turn 15, but ultimately look at the speed of the game right now. With every meta deck loving the OTK, making it half the work for them isn't really a smart idea.

It doesn't negate monster effects, true. So what? Use the fresh new Solemn Notice. As if the game is in need of a set of cards like this (now searchable) that virtually stop anything when used together.
LP are not as important as they used to be. Paying 4000 LP to activate this card is nothing, if it will stop your opponent completely.
And you're right, the game speed is very high. That just gives me reason. Pay any LP you need to pay (even 4000 or just 1500 with Notice) to just prevent your opponent from doing stuff, and win next turn.